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 Gottacon List C! - The Wolves of Space!

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PostSubject: Re: Gottacon List C! - The Wolves of Space!   Fri Mar 02, 2012 10:44 pm

Yes and no. Can you shake it up a bit if you go for a less then fully competitive list? I think so but otherwise...

You will field a Rune Priest, or Logan.

You WILL field Grey Hunters, and you WILL field Long Fangs, and you WILL likely max out on both. All my reading has indicated as such.

After that you can pick a transportation system (Razors/Rhinos/Pods)
After that you can pick some filler (Lone Wolf, Wolf Scout, TWC)

And that's about it from a competitive point of view as your going to run out of points! :p

I think its a pretty neat book just because of the Wolf Guard mechanic, but I dont think its as varied as BA or Necrons, or GK (but we are really still young on both Necron and GK competitive lists I think?)

I think really GH and LF's are simply too efficient at what you could ask any other Troop or Heavy Support squad to do, or even Elite or Fast Attack, so you are very much locked into those. At least that seems to be the consensus out there after reading a bunch.

Fielding 60 MEQ bodies is going to be pretty cool though. Very Happy
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PostSubject: Re: Gottacon List C! - The Wolves of Space!   Fri Mar 02, 2012 10:50 pm

In your words, BA didn't seem to compete with GK and SW.

And the options you listed are still more options than a lot of books get. Is it a ton of options? No. Is it more options (than most)? Yes.

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PostSubject: Re: Gottacon List C! - The Wolves of Space!   Fri Mar 02, 2012 11:01 pm

Yeah, I didnt think that BA really offered more, but the interwebs seems to disagree with me on that one (Stelek, Kirby, a few others)

As far as it being more options? Are you counting the transports in on that? I dont know about more then most? I would say its about the same as any other MEQ, about the same as IG, DE, really anything 5th.

Nids have 1 Elite choice, but after that, your in about the same boat flexibility wise are you not? Not at the same level of competitiveness on all slots, but again thats because i think GH and LF are just silly efficient.
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PostSubject: Re: Gottacon List C! - The Wolves of Space!   Fri Mar 02, 2012 11:12 pm

Well, as we've all learned (me perhaps moreso than others), just because the internet says something is good or bad doesn't mean it's true. I couldn't win with IG to save my damn life.

Maybe it's just a "grass is always greener" thing but it always seems like they have more viable options. But maybe that's just my feelings toward MEQ in general?

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PostSubject: Re: Gottacon List C! - The Wolves of Space!   Fri Mar 02, 2012 11:43 pm

Thats why I am committed to going MEQ of some kind next Gottacon. They have more units, more options, even if they are superficial, and some nice rules to cushion things when the dice gods laugh in our faces.
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PostSubject: Re: Gottacon List C! - The Wolves of Space!   Fri Mar 02, 2012 11:47 pm

It's probably worth keeping in the back of our minds that we may have Dark Angels and Chaos by next Gottacon as well...

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PostSubject: Re: Gottacon List C! - The Wolves of Space!   Fri Mar 02, 2012 11:50 pm

And 6th!

I dont think it will change too much tbh, but those other 2 codex's (codecii? whatever) will shake things up a bit no doubt. I live in fear actually that my World Eaters will all be afflicted with the Rage rule. No
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PostSubject: Re: Gottacon List C! - The Wolves of Space!   Fri Mar 02, 2012 11:54 pm

Gideus lives in fear that the cult troops will all become Elites again that are "unlocked" via SCs/Lords with Marks. I just don't see that or the Rage thing happening. Troops are golden and that's the one category (barring points costs) where Chaos doesn't need any messing around with. I think it's only going to get better (couldn't possibly get worse).

I'm curious to see how they're going to make Dark Angels viable. With GK having standard all Termie-troops and SW able to do the same, what can they do to make Deathwing stand out.

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PostSubject: Re: Gottacon List C! - The Wolves of Space!   Fri Mar 02, 2012 11:59 pm

Some special rules really I can see. Play with the points on upgrades perhaps. I heard they may get mini-chaplains to run around like Sang Priests?

For chaos, I can almost ensure that SC's or Marked lords will have a huge impact on the Cult units. I wont shed a single tear if the Lash/Plague/Zerker/Oblits list go away forever.

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PostSubject: Re: Gottacon List C! - The Wolves of Space!   Sat Mar 03, 2012 12:02 am

Gideus' concern, and I understand it, is Black Legion-style lists that make equal use of the four cult troops no longer being viable. He has 10+ of all four kinds (on top of loads of normal Marines) so he doesn't want what he has to be invalidated, you know?

And yeah, I would love to have Sang Priest/Wolf Guard style Chaplains. Although they might become one of the auto-includes of the army.

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PostSubject: Re: Gottacon List C! - The Wolves of Space!   Sat Mar 03, 2012 3:07 am

Not to get too far off topic here, but IG only has 2-3 competitive builds; if you consider anything without valkyries to be competitive.
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PostSubject: Re: Gottacon List C! - The Wolves of Space!   Sat Mar 03, 2012 2:28 pm

What I have heard is that the only way to take mixed cult will be running as Black Legion, the actual Legion itself.
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PostSubject: Re: Gottacon List C! - The Wolves of Space!   Sun Mar 04, 2012 12:40 pm

So, couldn't make it out last night (obviously): did you try the Wolves list?

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PostSubject: Re: Gottacon List C! - The Wolves of Space!   Sun Mar 04, 2012 1:21 pm

Yeah I did.

Logan
4 Terminators (PW/SS, TH/SS, WC/WC, PW/SB), Pod
2 Terminators (Cyclone)
3 WG (Combi-Melta)
1 WG

3 x 5 GH, Melta, Pod
2 x 10 GH, 2 Plasma

2 x 5 LF, 4 ML
1 x 5 LF, 4 MM, Pod

vs Nids

2 Trygons (one a Prime?)
2 Carnifex (with a Plasma Cannon shot?)
3 Hormagaunt squads?
1 Termagaunt squad?
1 x 3 Hive Guard
Swarmlord w/Tyrant Guard (1?)
2 x 1 Zoanthropes

Spearhead, 4 Objective Seize Ground.

I got first turn, and started unloading Missiles all over the place, he was doing all he could to get into a large piece of cover, but one Trygon was outside, so it went down Turn 1. I dropped 2 of the small squads into that area (empty pod, and 2 GH came down first turn, leaving Logan + Termi's in reserve with a final GH squad) and shot up a squad of gaunts of some type.

He moved towards those small units and they where promptly eaten. In hind sight I should have deployed all my units on foot, and just dropped those pods off the table, as all they really did was give him some cover!

The only unit I would say that threw a wrench into my plans was his outflanking stealers, who came in, and with some good play on his part where able to hold up in my backfield until turn 4, where I charged him with Logan and the 4 terminators. 5 Wolf Claw attacks, 4 Thunder Hammer, and 2 PW + help from the small GH squad back there where enough to end those guys, and thats with me losing 1 Terminator due to rends, and Logan was hypnotized so his 7 PW attacks didnt come into play. That unit is more then solid enough with Logan attached.

Was a good showing of some of the potential of some units. I won, 2-1 but it was a lot closer then we thought it would be after turn 1.
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PostSubject: Re: Gottacon List C! - The Wolves of Space!   Sun Mar 04, 2012 1:41 pm

Yeah, I'm scared of that list. I want to retire against you and claim a winning record Wink

The carnifexes had an ability called bio-plasma.

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PostSubject: Re: Gottacon List C! - The Wolves of Space!   Sun Mar 04, 2012 4:56 pm

Next weekend we should play. I may stick with this list for awhile and see. Only thing I may switch up is 1 lone wolf, for 5 wolf scouts.
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PostSubject: Re: Gottacon List C! - The Wolves of Space!   Sun Mar 04, 2012 5:34 pm

I like that Idea of the scouts. they can be very effective, but i've found that if they are not well enough equiped, they don't perform as expected. the last place to look IMHO would be the Rune Preist, only because more Psychic defence is good.
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PostSubject: Re: Gottacon List C! - The Wolves of Space!   Sun Mar 04, 2012 6:13 pm

Yeah thats the problem with the scout option. You probably are better off dropping both Lone Wolves and making a solid threat out of a larger scout squad.

A Rune priest would need to replace Logan, and I am not sure its even comparable.
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PostSubject: Re: Gottacon List C! - The Wolves of Space!   Sun Mar 04, 2012 6:47 pm

no, not comparable, but if you got a cheap one, it comes in the same FO slot as Logan....
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PostSubject: Re: Gottacon List C! - The Wolves of Space!   Sun Mar 04, 2012 8:42 pm

Whats a good setup for scouts? 170 points worth?

8 Scouts - 120
Melta - 10
3 Sniper - 9
Mark of the Wulfen- 15
Power Weapon - 15

Total 169

I dont know, seems like it's ok not super threatening to anything?
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PostSubject: Re: Gottacon List C! - The Wolves of Space!   Sun Mar 04, 2012 9:42 pm

Consider that Scout squad at 6-7 models with a Fist/CombiMelta Wolf Guard.... if they can still outflank, they would have much more punch.
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PostSubject: Re: Gottacon List C! - The Wolves of Space!   Sun Mar 04, 2012 9:52 pm

I dont think they can, you have to get a Wolf Guard Battle Leader at 70+ to do that.
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PostSubject: Re: Gottacon List C! - The Wolves of Space!   Mon Mar 05, 2012 12:06 am

In that case just nominate one drop GH to be you're rear lines smasher, maybe it has to be a full 10 with 2 melta, PF, Wulfen to be long term effective, consistenly in that role??
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PostSubject: Re: Gottacon List C! - The Wolves of Space!   Mon Mar 05, 2012 12:25 am

Yeah I'll see if Logan + MM Long Fangs can fill that niche.
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PostSubject: Re: Gottacon List C! - The Wolves of Space!   Mon Mar 05, 2012 6:56 am

Those scouts seem pointless? It's enough points to feel like a waste but not enough points to feel like a threat. With those 170 points, why don't you just buy another group of Grey Hunters in a pod and then...I don't know, something else. (Yes, I will always tell you you need more troops. Even if max out your Force Org, I will scream "MOAR TROOPZ!" from the roof tops.)

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